Re: Version information when building from git - Was: Many strange errors after upgrading to Evolution 3.24.2?

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
7 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Version information when building from git - Was: Many strange errors after upgrading to Evolution 3.24.2?

Ralf Mardorf-3
On Wed, 26 Apr 2017 13:17:48 +0200, Bjørn T Johansen wrote:
> On Wed, 2017-04-26 at 09:15 +0200, Milan Crha wrote:
> > I'm getting dislike Arch. You surely do not have 3.24.2, that had not
> > been released yet. 
>
> Understand your frustration.. But I see an issue has been created for
> this..

Hi,

don't expect that it will be fixed for Arch packages.

"Comment by Jan de Groot (JGC) - Wednesday, 26 April 2017, 10:21 GMT
IMHO this is only cosmetic. Distributions package software with
shitloads of patches and changes to default enabled/disabled options
most of the time, so even when evolution -v shows 3.24.1 there's no
warranty that it's the same 3.24.1 you would get when building from a
released tarball with default options.

If upstream cares about versions in evolution -v output, then upstream
should not commit "Post-release version bump" but do that on release.

We build from git because of 2 main reasons:
- easier to add upstream committed patches
- release tarballs are often generated with broken tools

Comment by Ralf Mardorf (Ralf) - Wednesday, 26 April 2017, 11:29 GMT
Hi,

actually it were _several_ Arch users who sent requests, providing wrong
version information. I posted to the mailing list only to correct the
version information. What other distros might do is irrelevant for us.
It's also unimportant if upstream decides to default to 3.24.1 or
3.24.2, if you compile and package 3.24.1gitabcd. In my experiences,
based on following the Evolution mailing list, official releases from
upstream are sometimes buggy, but not more or less often, than for the
majority of any other software, so IMO there's no reason to divert from
the Arch policy. However, if you feel the need to build from git, I
don't understand why you won't build with
-DVERSION_SUBSTRING="+gitXXXXXX" -DVERSION_COMMENT="+gitXXXXXX".
Anyway, I only wanted to inform you about an issue that arise on the
Evolution mailing list, feel free to ignore it.

Regards,
Ralf" - https://bugs.archlinux.org/task/53840

I edited my comment, the original comment included "Good PKGBUILDs fix
the version string, when building from git. This for example was always
done for claws-mail-git from AUR". I removed it from my comment, since
actually Claws' "About" version string was reformatted by the PKGBUILD,
but the string by default always included the git commit, it wasn't
added by the PKGBUILD (the package build script). Maybe the Evolution
developers could make this the default for Evolution, too, instead of
expecting that package maintainers do it.

Regards,
Ralf

PS: My apologies, I once again sent a mail to the list, by using the
wrong account, but actually it was Evolution, that once again failed to
select the correct address ;).

_______________________________________________
evolution-list mailing list
[hidden email]
To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ...
https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Version information when building from git - Was: Many strange errors after upgrading to Evolution 3.24.2?

Ralf Mardorf-3
On Wed, 2017-04-26 at 14:13 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote:

> On Wed, 26 Apr 2017 13:17:48 +0200, Bjørn T Johansen wrote:
> > On Wed, 2017-04-26 at 09:15 +0200, Milan Crha wrote:
> > > I'm getting dislike Arch. You surely do not have 3.24.2, that had not
> > > been released yet. 
> >
> > Understand your frustration.. But I see an issue has been created for
> > this..
>
> [snip]
> I edited my comment, the original comment included "Good PKGBUILDs fix
> the version string, when building from git. This for example was always
> done for claws-mail-git from AUR". I removed it from my comment, since
> actually Claws' "About" version string was reformatted by the PKGBUILD,
> but the string by default always included the git commit, it wasn't
> added by the PKGBUILD (the package build script). Maybe the Evolution
> developers could make this the default for Evolution, too, instead of
> expecting that package maintainers do it.
> [snip]

Maybe you could split the difference :) and care about the "premature"
version bump, the maintainers are willing to add the git version.

At https://bugs.archlinux.org/task/53840#comment157176 the maintainer
wrote:

"[snip] I could add -DVERSION_SUBSTRING= and/or -DVERSION_COMMENT= to
our PKGBUILD so it includes the git commit or Archlinux pkgver, but I
won't go into git log to find out which commit does a premature version
bump so I can revert that when packaging a branch snapshot."

Regards,
Ralf

_______________________________________________
evolution-list mailing list
[hidden email]
To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ...
https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Version information when building from git - Was: Many strange errors after upgrading to Evolution 3.24.2?

Milan Crha
In reply to this post by Ralf Mardorf-3
On Wed, 2017-04-26 at 14:13 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> don't expect that it will be fixed for Arch packages.

        Hi,
I see.

> "Comment by Jan de Groot (JGC) - Wednesday, 26 April 2017, 10:21 GMT
> IMHO this is only cosmetic. Distributions package software with
> shitloads of patches and changes to default enabled/disabled options
> most of the time, so even when evolution -v shows 3.24.1 there's no
> warranty that it's the same 3.24.1 you would get when building from a
> released tarball with default options.

Right. Still it's clear that it's 3.24.1 with added things, rather than
unreleased next version. It confuses people even more when you tell
them: "hey, you reported the issue against 3.24.2, aha, and that issue
*will be* fixed in *the next* 3.24.2 release". Who does understand
this? People reading archives? I doubt it. Just nobody but package
maintainer of that distro knows how this anomaly could happen.

> If upstream cares about versions in evolution -v output,

Misunderstanding, upstream cares of Help->About too.

> then upstream should not commit "Post-release version bump" but do
> that on release.

Well, hmm, rather nothing.

> We build from git because of 2 main reasons:
> - easier to add upstream committed patches

Okay, so Arch is bleeding bleeding bleeding edge distro. Noted. And
it's the only distribution (I know of) doing it this way. Why would one
make changes for one ditro, not the opposite? Distro is for users, no?

> - release tarballs are often generated with broken tools

Often? Give me a proof, please. Or not. I do not want to argue. The way
the reply had been written doesn't sound like leading to anything
usable.

> I removed it from my comment, since actually Claws' "About" version
> string was reformatted by the PKGBUILD,

I do not know how they do it, maybe some sort of hook when downloading
snapshot or whatever. It doesn't worth to do it in evolution* due to
one odd distribution. If they want to make chaos, then it's their call.

Anyway, thanks for the follow up Ralph. I consider this issue
closed/rejected by the Arch package maintainer.
        Bye,
        Milan
_______________________________________________
evolution-list mailing list
[hidden email]
To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ...
https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Version information when building from git - Was: Many strange errors after upgrading to Evolution 3.24.2?

Ralf Mardorf-3
On Wed, 26 Apr 2017 15:47:02 +0200, Milan Crha wrote:
>Okay, so Arch is bleeding bleeding bleeding edge distro. Noted. And
>it's the only distribution (I know of) doing it this way. Why would one
>make changes for one ditro, not the opposite? Distro is for users, no?

The Arch Linux policy is to stay as close as possible to official
releases from upstream, using default options and without patches.
Diverions from upstream default options, adding patches or building from
git are exceptions. I suspect that there are valid reasons to make
such an exception for GNOME packages. Arch is a real rolling release,
there never is a freeze, an approach that fits to the Arch Linux target
group. It's not a so called user-friendly distro. Evolution is the only
GNOME related software I'm using and the reason for this has nothing
to do with the way Arch Linux packager maintain GNOME related packages.
I suspect the reason they make this exception for GNOME packages, is
the same reason, that I stay completely away from GNOME software,
excepted of Evolution.

>> - release tarballs are often generated with broken tools  
>
>Often?

I disagree with this claim, too. This seemingly is true for GNOME and
maybe all bloated desktop environments.

>I consider this issue closed/rejected by the Arch package maintainer.

Not really :). As already sent to the list,
https://mail.gnome.org/archives/evolution-list/2017-April/msg00135.html ,
the maintainer is willing to add -DVERSION_SUBSTRING= and/or
-DVERSION_COMMENT= to the build process, including the git commit, but
not to care about to early increased upstream versions.

Regards,
Ralf

_______________________________________________
evolution-list mailing list
[hidden email]
To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ...
https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Version information when building from git - Was: Many strange errors after upgrading to Evolution 3.24.2?

Milan Crha
In reply to this post by Ralf Mardorf-3
On Wed, 2017-04-26 at 15:19 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote:

> Maybe you could split the difference :) and care about the
> "premature" version bump, the maintainers are willing to add the git
> version.
>
> At https://bugs.archlinux.org/task/53840#comment157176 the maintainer
> wrote:
>
> "[snip] I could add -DVERSION_SUBSTRING= and/or -DVERSION_COMMENT= to
> our PKGBUILD so it includes the git commit or Archlinux pkgver, but I
> won't go into git log to find out which commit does a premature
> version bump so I can revert that when packaging a branch snapshot."

        Hi,
okay, that sounds better. Let him use just one of those, better might
be -DVERSION_SUBSTRING="gitXXXXX", which will generate "X.Y.ZgitXXXXX".

I understand that it's a pita to hunt for "Post-release version bump"
commits, but it also makes sense to bump the version after release,
thus it's clear that this version is not 'the previous version'. Or I
just got use to this approach during the years. Each approach has its
pros and cons.
        Thanks and bye,
        Milan
_______________________________________________
evolution-list mailing list
[hidden email]
To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ...
https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Version information when building from git - Was: Many strange errors after upgrading to Evolution 3.24.2?

Milan Crha
In reply to this post by Ralf Mardorf-3
On Wed, 2017-04-26 at 16:09 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> Not really :). As already sent to the list,

        Hi,
you are right, I didn't notice your second message before sending mine,
while your second message invalidated few of my statements, in a good
way.
        Bye,
        Milan
_______________________________________________
evolution-list mailing list
[hidden email]
To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ...
https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Version information when building from git - Was: Many strange errors after upgrading to Evolution 3.24.2?

Ralf Mardorf-3
On Wed, 26 Apr 2017 16:13:22 +0200, Milan Crha wrote:
>Or I just got use to this approach during the years. Each approach has
>its pros and cons.

Hi,

you aren't alone, the developers of the Jack 2 sound server bump the
version after release, too. I'm not aware that anybody else does it
like Jack 2 and Evolution do, most (if not all other) developers
seemingly consider the git commits as an addition to the released
version.

On Wed, 26 Apr 2017 16:56:20 +0200, Milan Crha wrote:
>you are right, I didn't notice your second message before sending mine,
>while your second message invalidated few of my statements, in a good
>way.

:)

I informed him, that -DVERSION_SUBSTRING="gitXXXXX" should be used.

Regards,
Ralf



_______________________________________________
evolution-list mailing list
[hidden email]
To change your list options or unsubscribe, visit ...
https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/evolution-list