unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

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unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

d18jf98rw
Greetings!

In my continued evaluation of a migration from thunderbird to evolution I found another stopper.
Thunderbird has an option to skip saving sent messages. It comes very handy with both microsoft and google mail which automatically save outgoing email in appropriate folder.
Evolution is missing this option and user is forced to save outgoing mail to local Sent to avoid duplicate copies on microsoft and/or google IMAP server.
I am surprised that such a simple functionality hasn't yet been implemented.
Has anyone who uses evolution with google or microsoft mail ever noticed and/or complained about it?

Josh.

PS. v3.24.5
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Re: unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

Andre Klapper
On Mon, 2017-10-02 at 13:38 -0400, [hidden email] wrote:

> Thunderbird has an option to skip saving sent messages. It comes very
> handy with both microsoft and google mail which automatically save
> outgoing email in appropriate folder.
> Evolution is missing this option and user is forced to save outgoing
> mail to local Sent to avoid duplicate copies on microsoft and/or
> google IMAP server.
> I am surprised that such a simple functionality hasn't yet been
> implemented.
> Has anyone who uses evolution with google or microsoft mail ever
> noticed and/or complained about it?

What is the problem with ignoring the local Sent folder?
Feel free to set up a filter for outgoing messages to delete them.

andre
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Re: unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

d18jf98rw
In reply to this post by d18jf98rw
 
On Monday, October 2, 2017 3:11 PM, Paul Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:
 

> On Mon, 2017-10-02 at 13:38 -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
>> Thunderbird has an option to skip saving sent messages. It comes very
>> handy with both microsoft and google mail which automatically save
>> outgoing email in appropriate folder.  Evolution is missing this
>> option and user is forced to save outgoing mail to local Sent to
>> avoid duplicate copies on microsoft and/or google IMAP server.
> I'm afraid I don't understand the problem you're reporting.  I don't
> use any Exchange servers (anymore, thank $DIETY), but I use the Google
> IMAP server all day every day and I've never noticed duplicate messages
> appearing in my Sent folder.  I've just looked again and there is only
> one copy of each of my sent mails.
>
> Can you be more specific about exactly what the problem is?
>
> I'm using Evolution 3.22.6, and I set up my Google account using Online
> Accounts.  When I configure the account in Evolution (via
> "Preferences") in the Defaults tab the "Sent Messages Folder" value is
> "<me>@gmail.com/[Gmail]/Sent Mail".

Confirming that. Apparently gmail somehow figured out how to fix evolution problems but hotmail hasn't yet.

I have no idea why you mentioned *Exchange servers*. I clearly indicated that I am using hotmail in *IMAP* mode...

Josh.
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Re: unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

fmouse
In reply to this post by d18jf98rw
On Mon, 2017-10-02 at 13:38 -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
> In my continued evaluation of a migration from thunderbird to
> evolution I found another stopper.
> Thunderbird has an option to skip saving sent messages. It comes very
> handy with both microsoft and google mail which automatically save
> outgoing email in appropriate folder.
> Evolution is missing this option and user is forced to save outgoing
> mail to local Sent to avoid duplicate copies on microsoft and/or
> google IMAP server.

I assume you _do_ want to save outgoing emails, but are trying to avoid
duplication, so why not direct T-bird, and Evolution to save your
outgoing email in a single, common IMAP mail folder. I use Evo to
access my Gmail, and run my own mail server as well, and save all all
outgoing email to a folder called "current_outbound" on my own server.
Since I have full access to may mail storage folder I create a symbolic
link from a folder by year and month to the current_outbound folder so
all my outbound email from all my emails is segregated by year and
month. I change the symbolic link on the 1st of every month. You
wouldn't have to do anything this fancy, but using a single IMAP folder
for outbound mail would consolidate it. You can use Evolution to access
both your Gmail and your Hotmail via IMAP, so this solution should work
for all your email accounts.

Alternatively, as Andre said, you could easily configure a filter in
Evolution to delete emails you send.

I may be missing some of the nuances of your situation, but I hope this
at least gives you some ideas.

--
Lindsay Haisley       | "The first casualty when
FMP Computer Services |         war comes is truth."
512-259-1190          |            
http://www.fmp.com    |     -- Hiram W Johnson

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Re: unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

d18jf98rw
In reply to this post by d18jf98rw
 
On Monday, October 2, 2017 3:59 PM, Paul Smith <[hidden email]> wrote:
 

> On Mon, 2017-10-02 at 15:32 -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
>> I have no idea why you mentioned *Exchange servers*. I clearly
>> indicated that I am using hotmail in *IMAP* mode...
> There's no mention anywhere in your email of Hotmail, so I don't know
> how it could be clearly indicated.
>
> You referred to "microsoft mail" and "microsoft IMAP server".  I
> assumed Exchange (which you can, or used to be able to, connect to via
> IMAP) since it seemed logical to me that "Microsoft mail" would mean
> Exchange, and Hotmail would be referred to as "Hotmail".
Even if it is an Exchange on the back end evolution has no idea about it if account is set up as IMAP.

> I'd be pretty shocked if Gmail went to the trouble of "figuring out how
same here. I was just semi-joking.

> to fix evolution problems"... why would they bother to do that?  Also I
> can't remember any time that Gmail has ever duplicated Sent mail and
> I've been using them together for 5 years, at least.  Maybe Milan has
> an idea whether Evolution does anything special with Gmail accounts WRT
> saved mail.
I can see status message "saving to sent folder" flashing. Just don't have time to debug more right now. I definitely saw duplicate in gmail but was well more then 5 years ago and I haven't tried gmail with evolution since.

Anyway, there are duplicate Sent messages when using evolution with hotmail, live, msn etc .com mail accounts if settings are for storing sent mail in sent mailbox on server.

Josh.
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Re: unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

fmouse
On Mon, 2017-10-02 at 16:17 -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
> Even if it is an Exchange on the back end evolution has no idea about
> it if account is set up as IMAP.

Hmmm. I've always found Evolution to be very robust in handling email
accessed via IMAP - moreso even than T-bird, which seems to have issues
with folder subscription and unsubscription.

Since I had problems periodically with Evo trashing local mail when
using POP3, I long ago switched to IMAP with it and have been very
happy with it.

I _have_ had to set up accounts as IMAP+ (imapx) when there was a
choice between this and "standard" IMAP, since the latter had issues on
Evolution. It seems that this choice is no longer available, and IMAP+
seems to work just fine with both Google and my company mail server
running Courier-mta (with Courier-IMAP server).

What kind of problems are you having using Evolution as a client with
IMAP servers? IMAP is a standard communications protocol defined by
RFCs and any ESP that offers an IMAP server should be able to
communicate with any MUA which supports it - which includes Evolution.

Frankly, I wouldn't trust Microsoft any further than I could throw them
to support RFC-based Internet standards, but Gmail does, and as I've
said, Evo works fine for me on Gmail. The long and short of it is that
if you can get the IMAP support you want in T-bird, you'll also find it
there in Evolution, probably better.

--
Lindsay Haisley       | "The first casualty when
FMP Computer Services |         war comes is truth."
512-259-1190          |            
http://www.fmp.com    |     -- Hiram W Johnson

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Re: unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

Pete Biggs
In reply to this post by d18jf98rw

>
> In my continued evaluation of a migration from thunderbird to
> evolution I found another stopper.

Stopper? Seems a bit of an exaggeration ...

> I am surprised that such a simple functionality hasn't yet been
> implemented.

I'm sure there is an enhancement bug filed somewhere.

> Has anyone who uses evolution with google or microsoft mail ever
> noticed and/or complained about it?

https://mail.gnome.org/archives/evolution-list/2016-February/msg00228.html

https://mail.gnome.org/archives/evolution-list/2017-April/msg00046.html

P.

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Re: unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

Pete Biggs
In reply to this post by d18jf98rw

> > to fix evolution problems"... why would they bother to do that?  Also I
> > can't remember any time that Gmail has ever duplicated Sent mail and
> > I've been using them together for 5 years, at least.  Maybe Milan has
> > an idea whether Evolution does anything special with Gmail accounts WRT
> > saved mail.
>
> I can see status message "saving to sent folder" flashing. Just don't
> have time to debug more right now. I definitely saw duplicate in
> gmail but was well more then 5 years ago and I haven't tried gmail
> with evolution since.

I'm a bit confused here, but perhaps I've missed something. You say
that Evolution saving duplicate sent messages to Google Mail is a
"stopper", but that is based on behaviour you last saw "well more than
5 years ago" and you haven't tried it since?

>
> Anyway, there are duplicate Sent messages when using evolution with
> hotmail, live, msn etc .com mail accounts if settings are for storing
> sent mail in sent mailbox on server.
>
So why mention Google at all??

P.

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Re: unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

Pete Biggs
In reply to this post by Pete Biggs

>
> I'm sure there is an enhancement bug filed somewhere.

https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=599230

"Resolved: NOTABUG"

P.

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Re: unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

Milan Crha
In reply to this post by d18jf98rw
On Mon, 2017-10-02 at 13:38 -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
> Evolution is missing this option ...
> ...
>
> PS. v3.24.5

        Hi,
your version is not that old, nonetheless the requested change landed
for the current stable, since 3.26.0+:
https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=781744

There are also threads on this mailing list explaining what Gmail does
and what it doesn't with respect of Sent messages. I wouldn't call it
that you are forced to save to local Sent folder, it's the default
folder and it is even used for Gmail when you Lookup Folders in the
account Properties, at the Defaults tab. It's just for this reason of
the "duplicate" messages.

Neither I would say that one is unable to use Evolution *properly* with
the two. There is nothing improper about the saving of the Sent
messages.
        Bye,
        Milan
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Re: unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

d18jf98rw
On Tuesday, October 3, 2017 2:21 AM, Milan Crha <[hidden email]> wrote:
 
> On Mon, 2017-10-02 at 13:38 -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
>> Evolution is missing this option ...
>> ...
>>
>> PS. v3.24.5
> Hi,
> your version is not that old, nonetheless the requested change landed
Latest Fedora 26 ....

> for the current stable, since 3.26.0+:
> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=781744

Thank you very much! That is exactly what I was looking for many many years ago. Problem solved.
The rest of discussion is just a noise.

Josh.
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Re: unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

fmouse
On Tue, 2017-10-03 at 09:57 -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
> The rest of discussion is just a noise.

Thank you, Josh. It's good to know that if I can't contribute to a
discussion on this forum with Milan's authority and knowledge then I
should just keep my mouth shut ;)

--
Lindsay Haisley       | "The first casualty when
FMP Computer Services |         war comes is truth."
512-259-1190          |            
http://www.fmp.com    |     -- Hiram W Johnson

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Re: unable to properly use evolution with microsoft and google mail

Andre Klapper
In reply to this post by d18jf98rw
On Tue, 2017-10-03 at 09:57 -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
> The rest of discussion is just a noise.

FYI, as you chose to ignore
https://mail.gnome.org/archives/evolution-list/2017-September/msg00106.html 
I've put you on moderation.

andre
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